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  • Tellago && Tellago Studios 2010

    - by gsusx
    With 2011 around the corner we, at Tellago and Tellago Studios , we have been spending a lot of times evaluating our successes and failures (yes those too ;)) of 2010 and delineating some of our goals and strategies for 2011. When I look at 2010 here are some of the things that quickly jump off the page: Growing Tellago by 300% Launching a brand new company: Tellago Studios Expanding our customer base Establishing our business intelligence practice http://tellago.com/what-we-say/events/business-intelligence...(read more)

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  • DonXml does WCF in NYC

    - by gsusx
    Tomorrow is WCF day in New York city!!!!! My good friend and Tellago's CTO Don Demsak will be doing a session WCF Data and RIA Services at the WCF fire-starter event to be hosted at the Microsoft offices in New York city. Don has a encyclopedic knowledge of both technologies and will be sharing lots of best practices learned from applying these technologies in large service oriented environments. In addition to Don, my crazy Cuban friend Miguel Castro will also be presenting three sessions at the...(read more)

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  • Tellago announces SQL Server 2008 R2 BI quick adoption programs

    - by gsusx
    During the last year, we (Tellago) have been involved in various business intelligence initiatives that leverage some emerging BI techniques such as self-service BI or complex event processing (CEP). Specifically, in the last few months, we have partnered with Microsoft to deliver a series of events across the country where we present the different technologies of the SQL Server 2008 R2 BI stack such as PowerPivot, StreamInsight, Ad-Hoc Reporting and Master Data Services. As part of those events...(read more)

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  • SO-Aware sessions in Dallas and Houston

    - by gsusx
    Our WCF Registry: SO-Aware keeps being evangelized throughout the world. This week Tellago Studios' Dwight Goins will be speaking at Microsoft events in Dallas and Houston ( https://msevents.microsoft.com/cui/EventDetail.aspx?culture=en-US&EventID=1032469800&IO=ycqB%2bGJQr78fJBMJTye1oA%3d%3d ) about WCF management best practices using SO-Aware . If you are in the area and passionate about WCF you should definitely swing by and give Dwight a hard time ;)...(read more)

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  • Announcing SO-Aware Test Workbench

    - by gsusx
    Yesterday was a big day for Tellago Studios . After a few months hands down working, we announced the release of the SO-Aware Test Workbench tool which brings sophisticated performance testing and test visualization capabilities to theWCF world. This work has been the result of the feedback received by many of our SO-Aware and Tellago customers in terms of how to improve the WCF testing. More importantly, with the SO-Aware Test Workbench we are trying to address what has been one of the biggest challenges...(read more)

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  • What Web Technology to use?

    - by Sven
    Hey guys, I would like to start a project and I am concerning what kind of programming language/web framework to use. There is not that much logic involved. It's about a community-page with a lot of users(not that much at the beginning but I would like to be ready to welcome a lot), that should be able to communicate through private messages and a forum and there will be a lot of content (news, articles) to consume. I also want to provide several authorization settings to provide some content for only specific people. In fact it's about a content management system, but I want to design it functionally myself. And I want to use some external APIs. The only website I can think of with almost similar functionality is pokerstrategy.com. I looked up their job offers and it seems like they use java and php Maybe you guys can give me your thoughts. What would you use to encounter that requirements and how would you apprach? Thank you

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  • One page using querystring or many folders and pages?

    - by ClarkeyBoy
    I have an application where I have the 'core' code in one folder for which there is a virtual directory in the root, such that I can include any core files using /myApp/core/bla.asp. I then have two folders outside of this with a default.asp which currently use the querystring to define what page should be displayed. One page is for general users, the other will only be accessible to users who have permission to manage users / usergroups / permissions. The core code checks the querystring and then checks the permissions for that user. An example of this as it is now is default.asp?action=view&viewtype=list&objectid=server. I am not worried about SEO as this is an internal app and uses Windows Auth. My question is, is it better the way it is now or would it be better to have something like the following: /server/view/list/ /server/view/?id=123 /server/create/ /server/edit/?id=123 /server/remove/?id=123 In the above folders I would have a home page which defines all the variables which are currently determined by the querystring - in /server/create/ for example, I would define the action as 'create', object name as 'server' and so on. In terms of future development, I really have no idea which method would be best. I think the 2nd method would be best in terms of following what page does what but this is such a huge change to make at this stage that I would really like some opinions, preferably based on experience. PS Sorry if the tags are wrong - I am new to this forum and thought this was a bit too much of a discussion for StackOverflow as that is very much right / wrong answer based. I got the idea SE is more discussion based.

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  • Teacher demands excessive/unjustified use of Design Patterns

    - by SoboLAN
    I study computer science and I have a class called "Programming Techniques". Its purpose is to teach (us) good object oriented design principles. During the semester we have homeworks, programs that we must write to demonstrate what we've learned. The lab assistant demands for each of these homeworks that specific design patterns should be used. For example, the current homework is an application used for processing customer orders. We are demanded to use either "Factory Method" or "Abstract Factory" design patterns for this. It gets even worse: at the end of the semester we must write a program (something more complex) that must use at least one creational pattern, at least one structural pattern and at least one behavioural pattern. Is it normal to demand this ? I mean, forcing us to design our programs in such a way that a specific design pattern makes sense is just beyond what I consider ok. If I'm a car mechanic and have a huge tool box, then I will use a certain tool from that box if and when the situation demands it. Not more, not less. If my design of the application doesn't demand at all the use of "Abstract Factory" (for example), then why should I implement it ? I'm not sure yet if the senior lecturer agrees with what the lab assistant is demanding, but I want to talk to him about it and I need solid arguments to do so. How should I approach this problem with him ? PS: I'm sure there must be a better way to teach us these things. Maybe making us each week read about 3 design patterns and the next week giving us a test with small but specific programming or architectural situations/problems. The goal in that test would be to identify what design patterns would make sense and how they could be implemented. This way, he can see if we understand them. EDIT: These homeworks are not just 100-line programs, they have quite a lot of requirements and are fairly complicated. This is the reason we have about 2 - 3 weeks of deadline for each of them. I agree that practicing this is the best way to learn. But shouldn't smaller programs/applications be used for this ? Something just for demonstrating purposes. Not big programs with lots of requirements/classes/etc.

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  • Finding the right back-end developer

    - by John Watson
    I am creating a websites for mobile phone tests. Users can post their own tests and combine it with an existing rating of each product. I do only front-end development and I have no idea about back-end - php, sql, etc. I am not sure I should operate the website without this knowledge but my first thought is to get a professional whom I would give my website to, so that he can do the rest. Only thing is that I need to update it regularly and post my own tests. I don't know how that works and how I should approach this. My understanding is that, after I have finished the website (written in HTML, CSS, JavaScript/jQuery), I would go and find a php programmer and tell me to put it online, make it secure, make sure that the open-source facility (users post their own tests) and that it runs smoothly with the host/server I've chosen. Could you tell me if my approach makes sense (is that the way how to do it)? What should I consider when searching the right back-end developer concerning the right price performance, trust, etc. ?

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  • Getting a design company to embrace the benefits of good development

    - by Toby
    I know there are already various topics discussing what we can do to get managers to buy into good development practices, but I was wondering if there are any specific things we can do to explain to designers that Web Development is more than just turning their design into a website. I want to try and push them to design based on progressive enhancement, responsive design and ajax but I think there is a trend to stick to the print based design principles, which is understandable as it is their background, but is frustrating to a dev.

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  • What every beginner should know about website development? [closed]

    - by user975234
    I am a novice at building websites and considering to make one. But there is a lot of confusion that's going on right now. I guess every beginner faces them. Few questions that come up are: I have an idea and a need a website. That's all i know right now. But how do i start ? HTML is for sure the basic language but there are a hell of other technologies too. What is actually asp, php, ruby etc? How do i choose the right one from them? Other than asp, php there is javascript and other languages under the same belt. What are they used for? Hosting. When i am choosing the host, what considerations i have to keep in mind ? What support do i need from them (other than getting some important space obviously!). I am considering of making the website in ruby on rails. I don't know about php and what effect it would have if i choose ruby over php. I thought about ruby just because its new and i dont want to learn some thing "not new"! :P Moreover what is a framework and how does a framework effect my development process? These three questions are just to explain my "confusion" better. There is obviously a lot more to it. Just to try to answer how the flow of website development goes keeping in mind my questions!

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  • Making a design for a Problem [closed]

    - by Vaibhav Agarwal
    I have written many codes using OOPS and I am still to understand when is a code good enough to be accepted by experts. The thought procedure of every man is different and so is the design. My question is should I do something in particular to design my programs in such a way that they are good enough to be accepted by people. Other thing I have also read Head First Object Oriented Design but at last I feel that the way they design the problems is much different I would have designed them.

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  • How do you deal with design in Scrum?

    - by Seth
    How do you deal with design in Scrum? Do you still have well written design documents for each scrum iteration? Do you just do design notes featuring UML diagrams? Or do you just have well commented code? Each iteration may involve changing design so I just wanted to know how people capture this so new developers have an easy job of understanding the domain and getting on board as rapidly as possible.

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  • How do you deal with design in Scrum?

    - by Seth
    How do you deal with design in Scrum? Do you still have well written design documents for each scrum iteration? Do you just do design notes featuring UML diagrams? Or do you just have well commented code? Each iteration may involve changing design so I just wanted to know how people capture this so new developers have an easy job of understanding the domain and getting on board as rapidly as possible.

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  • How can I get non-programmer colleagues on board with bespoke software rather than Dynamics CRM + Sharepoint?

    - by Bendos
    I am working with a company which designs and builds one-off machines. They have been 'dabbling' with hosted Dynamics CRM and Sharepoint (on different servers!) in an attempt to centralise their data and help colleagues collaborate more effectively across projects. They haven't used either system to their potential. Now we are looking at the engineering department who already use a form of version control software for the various CAD files (Autodesk Vault) however it is becoming increasingly necessary to implement more of a generic file version control system as they use many more files than can be managed in Vault (sometimes just photos or scans of paper documents), hence why they were looking at using Sharepoint. However... as the 'programmer' of the bunch, I can see several scenarios which don't seem to fit well with the Dynamics + Sharepoint approach; simple reports based on cross-table queries, exporting certain metrics as a spreadsheet, defining project hierarchies and many-many relationships, and as such I have been pushing for an in-house developed 'ECM' / 'ERP' software package (perhaps in .NET or php). Some colleagues seem to attach a greater value to the MS software (perhaps becuase it has a logo!) but don't see that it's just a framework, not a solution. Can anyone provide a good example of when custom software would actually be better than using Dynamics + Sharepoint and how do I relate that to non-technical staff?

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  • Pending and Approval process

    - by zen
    So let's say I have a DB table with 8 columns, one is a unique auto-incrementing used as ID. So I have a page that pulls in the info for each row based on query string ID. I want to give my users the ability to propose changes. Kinda like a wiki setup. So I was thinking I should just have another duplicate table or maybe database altogether (without the auto-incrementing column and maybe with a date edited column) that keeps all proposed changes in queue and then when I approve them, the script can move the row from the proposed DB to the real DB. Does this sound good or is there a better process for this?

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  • Web programming, standard way to deal with a response that takes time to complete

    - by wobbily_col
    With normal form submission I use the pattern Post / Redirect / Get, when processing the forms. I have a database application built with Django. I want to allow the users to select a number of items from the database, then launch a computationally intensive task based on those items. I expect the task to take between 10 minutes and 2 hours to complete. Is there a standard approach to dealing with requests like this (i.e. that don't return immediately)? Ideally there would be some way to display the progress.

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  • MVC design question for forms

    - by kenny99
    Hi, I'm developing an app which has a large amount of related form data to be handled. I'm using a MVC structure and all of the related data is represented in my models, along with the handling of data validation from form submissions. I'm looking for some advice on a good way to approach laying out my controllers - basically I will have a huge form which will be broken down into manageable categories (similar to a credit card app) where the user progresses through each stage/category filling out the answers. All of these form categories are related to the main relation/object, but not to each other. Does it make more sense to have each subform/category as a method in the main controller class (which will make that one controller fairly massive), or would it be better to break each category into a subclass of the main controller? It may be just for neatness that the second approach is better, but I'm struggling to see much of a difference between either creating a new method for each category (which communicates with the model and outputs errors/success) or creating a new controller to handle the same functionality. Thanks in advance for any guidance!

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  • Microsoft Declares the Future of ASP.NET is Web API

    - by sbwalker
    Sitting on a plane on my way home from Tech Ed 2012 in Orlando, I thought it would be a good time to jot down some key takeaways from this year’s conference. Some of these items I have known since the Microsoft MVP Summit which occurred in Redmond in late February ( but due to NDA restrictions I could not share them with the developer community at large ) and some of them are a result of insightful conversations with a wide variety of industry insiders and Microsoft employees at the conference. First, let’s travel back in time 4 years to the Microsoft MVP Summit in 2008. Microsoft was facing some heat from market newcomer Ruby on Rails and responded with a new web development framework of its own, ASP.NET MVC. At the Summit they estimated that MVC would only be applicable for ~10% of all new web development projects. Based on that prediction I questioned why they were investing such considerable resources for such a relative edge case, but my guess is that they felt it was an important edge case at the time as some of the more vocal .NET evangelists as well as some very high profile start-ups ( ie. Twitter ) had publicly announced their intent to use Rails. Microsoft made a lot of noise about MVC. In fact, they focused so much of their messaging and marketing hype around MVC that it appeared that WebForms was essentially dead. Yes, it may have been true that Microsoft continued to invest in WebForms, but from an outside perspective it really appeared that MVC was the only framework getting any real attention. As a result, MVC started to gain market share. An inside source at Microsoft told me that MVC usage has grown at a rate of about 5% per year and now sits at ~30%. Essentially by focusing so much marketing effort on MVC, Microsoft actually created a larger market demand for it.  This is because in the Microsoft ecosystem there is somewhat of a bandwagon mentality amongst developers. If Microsoft spends a lot of time talking about a specific technology, developers get the perception that it must be really important. So rather than choosing the right tool for the job, they often choose the tool with the most marketing hype and then try to sell it to the customer. In 2010, I blogged about the fact that MVC did not make any business sense for the DotNetNuke platform. This was because our ecosystem relied on third party extensions which were dependent on the WebForms model. If we migrated the core to MVC it would mean that all of the third party extensions would no longer be compatible, which would be an irresponsible business decision for us to make at the expense of our users and customers. However, this did not stop the debate from continuing to occur in our ecosystem. Clearly some developers had drunk Microsoft’s Kool-Aid about MVC and were of the mindset, to paraphrase an old Scottish saying, “If its not MVC, it’s crap”. Now, this is a rather ignorant position to take as most of the benefits of MVC can be achieved in WebForms with solid architecture and responsible coding practices. Clean separation of concerns, unit testing, and direct control over page output are all possible in the WebForms model – it just requires diligence and discipline. So over the past few years some horror stories have begun to bubble to the surface of software development projects focused on ground-up rewrites of web applications for the sole purpose of migrating from WebForms to MVC. These large scale rewrites were typically initiated by engineering teams with only a single argument driving the business decision, that Microsoft was promoting MVC as “the future”. These ill-fated rewrites offered no benefit to end users or customers and in fact resulted in a less stable, less scalable and more complicated systems – basically taking one step forward and two full steps back. A case in point is the announcement earlier this week that a popular open source .NET CMS provider has decided to pull the plug on their new MVC product which has been under active development for more than 18 months and revert back to WebForms. The availability of multiple server-side development models has deeply fragmented the Microsoft developer community. Some folks like to compare it to the age-old VB vs. C# language debate. However, the VB vs. C# language debate was ultimately more of a religious war because at least the two dominant programming languages were compatible with one another and could be used interchangeably. The issue with WebForms vs. MVC is much more challenging. This is because the messaging from Microsoft has positioned the two solutions as being incompatible with one another and as a result web developers feel like they are forced to choose one path or another. Yes, it is true that it has always been technically possible to use WebForms and MVC in the same project, but the tooling support has always made this feel “dirty”. The fragmentation has also made it difficult to attract newcomers as the perceived barrier to entry for learning ASP.NET has become higher. As a result many new software developers entering the market are gravitating to environments where the development model seems more simple and intuitive ( ie. PHP or Ruby ). At the same time that the Web Platform team was busy promoting ASP.NET MVC, the Microsoft Office team has been promoting Sharepoint as a platform for building internal enterprise web applications. Sharepoint has great penetration in the enterprise and over time has been enhanced with improved extensibility capabilities for software developers. But, like many other mature enterprise ASP.NET web applications, it is built on the WebForms development model. Similar to DotNetNuke, Sharepoint leverages a rich third party ecosystem for both generic web controls and more specialized WebParts – both of which rely on WebForms. So basically this resulted in a situation where the Web Platform group had headed off in one direction and the Office team had gone in another direction, and the end customer was stuck in the middle trying to figure out what to do with their existing investments in Microsoft technology. It really emphasized the perception that the left hand was not speaking to the right hand, as strategically speaking there did not seem to be any high level plan from Microsoft to ensure consistency and continuity across the different product lines. With the introduction of ASP.NET MVC, it also made some of the third party control vendors scratch their heads, and wonder what the heck Microsoft was thinking. The original value proposition of ASP.NET over Classic ASP was the ability for web developers to emulate the highly productive desktop development model by using abstract components for creating rich, interactive web interfaces. Web control vendors like Telerik, Infragistics, DevExpress, and ComponentArt had all built sizable businesses offering powerful user interface components to WebForms developers. And even after MVC was introduced these vendors continued to improve their products, offering greater productivity and a superior user experience via AJAX to what was possible in MVC. And since many developers were comfortable and satisfied with these third party solutions, the demand remained strong and the third party web control market continued to prosper despite the availability of MVC. While all of this was going on in the Microsoft ecosystem, there has also been a fundamental shift in the general software development industry. Driven by the explosion of Internet-enabled devices, the focus has now centered on service-oriented architecture (SOA). Service-oriented architecture is all about defining a public API for your product that any client can consume; whether it’s a native application running on a smart phone or tablet, a web browser taking advantage of HTML5 and Javascript, or a rich desktop application running on a PC. REST-based services which utilize the less verbose characteristics of JSON as a transport mechanism, have become the preferred approach over older, more bloated SOAP-based techniques. SOA also has the benefit of producing a cross-platform API, as every major technology stack is able to interact with standard REST-based web services. And for web applications, more and more developers are turning to robust Javascript libraries like JQuery and Knockout for browser-based client-side development techniques for calling web services and rendering content to end users. In fact, traditional server-side page rendering has largely fallen out of favor, resulting in decreased demand for server-side frameworks like Ruby on Rails, WebForms, and (gasp) MVC. In response to these new industry trends, Microsoft did what it always does – it immediately poured some resources into developing a solution which will ensure they remain relevant and competitive in the web space. This work culminated in a new framework which was branded as Web API. It is convention-based and designed to embrace native HTTP standards without copious layers of abstraction. This framework is designed to be the ultimate replacement for both the REST aspects of WCF and ASP.NET MVC Web Services. And since it was developed out of band with a dependency only on ASP.NET 4.0, it means that it can be used immediately in a variety of production scenarios. So at Tech Ed 2012 it was made abundantly clear in numerous sessions that Microsoft views Web API as the “Future of ASP.NET”. In fact, one Microsoft PM even went as far as to say that if we look 3-4 years into the future, that all ASP.NET web applications will be developed using the Web API approach. This is a fairly bold prediction and clearly telegraphs where Microsoft plans to allocate its resources going forward. Currently Web API is being delivered as part of the MVC4 package, but this is only temporary for the sake of convenience. It also sounds like there are still internal discussions going on in terms of how to brand the various aspects of ASP.NET going forward – perhaps the moniker of “ASP.NET Web Stack” coined a couple years ago by Scott Hanselman and utilized as part of the open source release of ASP.NET bits on Codeplex a few months back will eventually stick. Web API is being positioned as the unification of ASP.NET – the glue that is able to pull this fragmented mess back together again. The  “One ASP.NET” strategy will promote the use of all frameworks - WebForms, MVC, and Web API, even within the same web project. Basically the message is utilize the appropriate aspects of each framework to solve your business problems. Instead of navigating developers to a fork in the road, the plan is to educate them that “hybrid” applications are a great strategy for delivering solutions to customers. In addition, the service-oriented approach coupled with client-side development promoted by Web API can effectively be used in both WebForms and MVC applications. So this means it is also relevant to application platforms like DotNetNuke and Sharepoint, which means that it starts to create a unified development strategy across all ASP.NET product lines once again. And so what about MVC? There have actually been rumors floated that MVC has reached a stage of maturity where, similar to WebForms, it will be treated more as a maintenance product line going forward ( MVC4 may in fact be the last significant iteration of this framework ). This may sound alarming to some folks who have recently adopted MVC but it really shouldn’t, as both WebForms and MVC will continue to play a vital role in delivering solutions to customers. They will just not be the primary area where Microsoft is spending the majority of its R&D resources. That distinction will obviously go to Web API. And when the question comes up of why not enhance MVC to make it work with Web API, you must take a step back and look at this from the higher level to see that it really makes no sense. MVC is a server-side page compositing framework; whereas, Web API promotes client-side page compositing with a heavy focus on web services. In order to make MVC work well with Web API, would require a complete rewrite of MVC and at the end of the day, there would be no upgrade path for existing MVC applications. So it really does not make much business sense. So what does this have to do with DotNetNuke? Well, around 8-12 months ago we recognized the software industry trends towards web services and client-side development. We decided to utilize a “hybrid” model which would provide compatibility for existing modules while at the same time provide a bridge for developers who wanted to utilize more modern web techniques. Customers who like the productivity and familiarity of WebForms can continue to build custom modules using the traditional approach. However, in DotNetNuke 6.2 we also introduced a new Service Framework which is actually built on top of MVC2 ( we chose to leverage MVC because it had the most intuitive, light-weight REST implementation in the .NET stack ). The Services Framework allowed us to build some rich interactive features in DotNetNuke 6.2, including the Messaging and Notification Center and Activity Feed. But based on where we know Microsoft is heading, it makes sense for the next major version of DotNetNuke ( which is expected to be released in Q4 2012 ) to migrate from MVC2 to Web API. This will likely result in some breaking changes in the Services Framework but we feel it is the best approach for ensuring the platform remains highly modern and relevant. The fact that our development strategy is perfectly aligned with the “One ASP.NET” strategy from Microsoft means that our customers and developer community can be confident in their current and future investments in the DotNetNuke platform.

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  • What is the rationale behind Apache Jena's *everything is an interface if possible* design philosophy?

    - by David Cowden
    If you are familiar with the Java RDF and OWL engine Jena, then you have run across their philosophy that everything should be specified as an interface when possible. This means that a Resource, Statement, RDFNode, Property, and even the RDF Model, etc., are, contrary to what you might first think, Interfaces instead of concrete classes. This leads to the use of Factories quite often. Since you can't instantiate a Property or Model, you must have something else do it for you --the Factory design pattern. My question, then, is, what is the reasoning behind using this pattern as opposed to a traditional class hierarchy system? It is often perfectly viable to use either one. For example, if I want a memory backed Model instead of a database-backed Model I could just instantiate those classes, I don't need ask a Factory to give me one. As an aside, I'm in the process of writing a library for manipulating Pearltrees data, which is exported from their website in the form of an RDF/XML document. As I write this library, I have many options for defining the relationships present in the Peartrees data. What is nice about the Pearltrees data is that it has a very logical class system: A tree is made up of pearls, which can be either Page, Reference, Alias, or Root pearls. My question comes from trying to figure out if I should adopt the Jena philosophy in my library which uses Jena, or if I should disregard it, pick my own design philosophy, and stick with it.

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  • Update: Super Hero

    While I was looking for a completely different article back in 2007, I came across my Super Hero & Super Villain rating... Well, it was time for an update: Your Super Hero results: You are Spider-Man Spider-Man 75% Supergirl 70% Green Lantern 70% Robin 57% The Flash 55% Hulk 50% Catwoman 50% Superman 45% Batman 40% Wonder Woman 40% Iron Man 40% You are intelligent, witty, a bit geeky and have great power and responsibility. Click here to take the Superhero Personality Test

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  • The C++ web stack, is there one?

    - by NimChimpsky
    Java would be jsps and servlets (or a framework such as Spring) running on the JVM and tomcat (or glassfish etc). C# would be asp and C# running on dot.net framework and IIS ? (I have no experience with this please correct and improve my terminology) Is there an equivalent for C++ ? I could happily call some C++ from a java servlet/controller but was wondering if there are existing frameworks and libraries out there specifically for creating business logic in C++ with a web front end.

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  • What patterns exist for web application development?

    - by DaveDev
    I understand that MVC & MVP are design patterns that are commonly used for web development, as well as ASP.NET WebForms (more of an anti-pattern, really!). What other patterns are used in web application development? I'm not necessarily saying I want to learn/use new patterns just to be different - I do believe there's a lot of value in taking the conventional route - but I think it's good to know what else is out there to be able to properly understand what I'm currently working with. Thanks.

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