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  • Windows 7 setup hangs after "Starting Windows..."-screen

    - by Eirik Lillebo
    Hi! I'm having some trouble installing Windows 7. I need to install the OS from boot in order to split my C: into two different partitions, as this is not allowed when installing from inside Vista. When I boot up from the install disc, I get the usual "Windows is copying files..."-screen, shortly followed by the "Starting Windows..."-screen with the animated window-logo or whatever. Then it looks as if the installation is about to begin with a blue screen and a cursor I can move around, but here it all stops. Nothing more happens, and the setup seems to hang. Not a single key on my keyboard has any effect, and all I am left to do is to abort and reboot. I've tried to install using two different DVDs (not clones), and the same thing happens every time. What may be causing this, and how may I fix it? Thanks in advance :)

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  • TFS2010 Hangs “Waiting for Build Agent”

    - by Qpirate
    I have asked this question over on SO the link to the question is here but i am hoping this is a better place to ask it. I have 3 VM's each running the TFS Build Host Service 1 has 1 controller and 1 agent 2 have 2 Build Agents each. Most of the time (7\10 builds) it comes back with the following error message TF215097: An error occurred while initializing a build for build definition BUILD_DEFINITION: There was no endpoint listening at http://MACHINE1:9191/Build/v3.0/Services/Controller/14 that could accept the message. This is often caused by an incorrect address or SOAP action. See InnerException, if present, for more details. and there is no errors when i do get this message. the following is the config file that i have created <configuration> <appSettings> <add key="traceWriter" value="true"/> </appSettings> <system.diagnostics> <switches> <add name="BuildServiceTraceLevel" value="4"/> <add name="API" value="4"/> <add name="Authentication" value="4"/> <add name="Authorization" value="4"/> <add name="Database" value="4"/> <add name="General" value="4"/> <add name="traceLevel" value="4"/> </switches> <trace autoflush="true" indentsize="4"> <listeners> <add name="myListener" type="Microsoft.TeamFoundation.TeamFoundationTextWriterTraceListener,Microsoft.TeamFoundation.Common, Version=10.0.0.0, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=b03f5f7f11d50a3a" initializeData="c:\logs\TFSBuildServiceHost.exe.log" /> <remove name="Default" /> </listeners> </trace> </system.diagnostics> </configuration> I do have my own custom activities in my build process but this does not seem to be a problem as sometimes the build actually does go. I have tried refreshing the template as some sites suggest. Has anyone come across a solution for this problem? or can anyone tell me how to catch these errors when they happen?

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  • SSH tunneling hangs with many connections

    - by middleofdreams
    I am forced to use SSH tunneling to access many servers (over 100) via one gateway server. To keep connection alive I am using autossh. Everything works pretty well until there is high traffic (people are connecting to most of the servers at once). then ssh process reaches 12% of cpu (which is configured maximum for separate process) and no connection is working anymore - i have to restart autossh script. What could be the possible reason for that?

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  • Windows 7 hangs after going into sleep a second time

    - by Brian Stephenson
    I've searched everywhere around Google and can't figure out why this is happening so I decide to ask here to see if anyone has a problem like this. Like it says in the title, whenever I sleep ONCE I'm able to wake the system, but going back to sleep again AFTER waking up for the first time results in it hanging on no input and no output, with the fan spinning as fast as possible and alot of heat being spewed out by the fan as well. I've tried various things like setting all USB Hub Root's to not get switched off for power saving, disabling USB selective suspend, disabling PCI-e link state power management, and even unplugging ALL USB devices and it wont wake up after the second attempt. And I've even waited up to a full hour of the CPU fan spinning loudly and it's still stuck trying to wake up. The only USB devices I use are a Microsoft USB Comfort Curve Keyboard 2000 (IntelliType Pro) and a generic HID compliant mouse from Creative model number OMC90S "CREATIVE MOUSE OPTICAL LITE". My other devices like external drives and controllers are unplugged when I'm not using them as having too many USB devices plugged in at a time causes a deadlock on almost all of the ports I have. Here's my system specifications (Most of these are from CPU-Z): Brand: Gateway DX4300-19 Mainboard: Gateway RS780 Chipset: AMD 780G Rev 00 Southbridge: AMD SB700 Rev 00 LPCIO: ITE IT8718 BIOS: American Megatrends Inc. ver P01-A4 09/15/2009 CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 810 at 2.60 GHz RAM: 8.0 GB DDR2 Dual Channel Ganged Mode at 400 MHz GPU: ATI Radeon HD3200 Graphics Intergrated - RS780 OS: Windows 7 Home Premium x64 OEM (Acer Group) HDD: WDC WD10EADS-22M2B0 1.0 TB (Western Digital Green Caviar) My BIOS has absolutely no control over how I setup the sleep mode to be either S1 or S3. So I can't check these settings or even change them. Hybrid sleep is also disabled, I can successfully go into hibernation and wake from hibernation but this is painfully slow due to a harddrive problem I'm having with this "Green Drive". (Hibernation takes over ~3 minutes to complete) Any help would be appreciated, thanks.

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  • /usr/bin/install hangs, apparently due to SELinux

    - by Cooper
    I'm trying to use the GNU coreutils install utility, however it is hanging: /usr/bin/install -v test_file test_dir/ `test_file' -> `test_dir/test_file I see the same behavior whether I run as a normal user, or root/sudo. I ran an strace -f, and this is the end of the output: ... read(4, "<username>\t-d\tsystem_u:object_r:ho"..., 4096) = 2197 <0.000012> brk(0x6e3b1000) = 0x6e3b1000 <0.000009> mmap(NULL, 29138944, PROT_READ|PROT_WRITE, MAP_PRIVATE|MAP_ANONYMOUS, -1, 0) = 0x2abd831ae000 <0.000014> munmap(0x2abd815dd000, 29138944) = 0 <0.003466> The read() is reading from /etc/selinux/targeted/contexts/files/file_contexts.homedirs, apparently successfully. It appears that the process is hanging right after the munmap, but continues to eat 100% CPU. My two questions are: 1) Any good way to see what is going on with the process? I'm currently too lazy to compile a debug version of install I can run gdb on - but a strong suggestion in an answer here may motivate me to do so if needed. 2) Any idea what the SELinux issue could be? I'm not too familiar with SELinux. Additional info of possible relevance: # ls -Z drwxr-xr-x my_user 7001 user_u:object_r:user_home_t test_dir -rw-r--r-- my_user 7001 user_u:object_r:user_home_t test_file # id ... context=user_u:system_r:unconfined_t # uname -a Linux hostname 2.6.18-238.1.1.el5 #1 SMP Tue Jan 4 13:32:19 EST 2011 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux I am suspicious that SELinux + Quest Authentication Services (QAS) is causing the issue. QAS is generally well behaved, but it did cause the /etc/selinux/targeted/contexts/files/file_contexts.homedirs to get quite large (~18k users, @23 lines per user) Update: install -v -Z user_u:object_r:user_home_t file dir/ seems to work. Can anyone suggest why, given that SELinux is in permissive mode (see comments).

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  • Ubuntu server hangs on reboot "could not stat resume device file"

    - by matnagel
    Instead of booting into the running system this machine stops and on the terminal I can see a message: could not stat resume device file /dev/sdb5 When I attach a keyboard and press enter the boot continues and the machine comes up like normal. But it's essential that this machine comes up under most circumstancs alone. There never was something like a "resume" on this machine. I tried several times to reboot, but this does not happen on all boots, I can not find a pattern here. There is a software raid running on the box. This is the syslog during boot: http://privatepaste.com/ff0fd0a51c/sdabfjahfgasjkgfu4gfsdzjcgfafasdjfhgasdcjfgauzfgafasgdufzg How can I get rid of this boot failure? We do not need resumes and best would be something that works here and now.

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  • Asus M4A79XTD-EVO / AMD Phenom II X4 965 Crashes / BSOD / Hangs / Restarts

    - by Tiby
    I'll try to be as concise as possible because I have a lot to say about my problem, but I'd rather say it when asked or when I feel it's necessary, just to make this initial reading clearer. For about a year and a half I have periods when my system has all the problems in the title (I'll use the word 'crash' for either one). I'll list some patterns and what I tried to do and what were the results, but the list is not exclusive: usually it crashes when a CPU-intensive operation is in progress, like a game or video encoding or HD movie rendering, but also sometimes crashes when I'm doing nothing after a first crash the system is very unstable and sometimes it crashes even during POST, or doesn't boot at all Some months ago I went to a local service (one that you just put your computer on the table and sit there with a guy and trying to figure out the problem, very rare these days) and they used OCCT and it crashed every time he changed some part to test it out (PSU, RAM, video card, HDD). The last one was the CPU. They changed the CPU and it didn't crash any more. Then when they put my CPU back, it also didn't crash. We figured that the trouble was the thermal paste (probably some 2 years old) because it was the only thing changed while testing. Up until 2 weeks ago, I haven't had any more problems. 2 weeks ago the problems reappeared. I changed again the thermal paste, put some Arctic Silver 5, and for about a week everything worked perfect (tried some games, video encoding, no more crashes). But again it started crashing in the same fashion as the first time. But now, instead, I figured out a very odd behaviour: when I start some of the apps above, in most cases it crashes if I start OCCT and turn on the CPU test, and run any of the programs above, it doesn't crash, even if the CPU is on 100% load (and 65-70 degrees Celsius temperature) if I shut down OCCT and continue using the programs, it crashes in a very short period of time (even if the CPU is on 5-10% load and 40 degrees) There are so many patterns and temporary solutions that I figured out in this year and a half period of time, that I can't include them all because I don't know which one are more relevant, but I'll happily provide any details you ask. My system is: CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 965 (3400 MHz - 125W) MB: ASUS M4A79XTD - EVO RAM: Corsair Vengeance 8 GB (2 x 4GB) CL8 1600MHz Video: HIS Radeon HD5770 1GB PSU: Corsair 750W HDD: Western Digital 1TB OS: Win 7 Enterprise 64 BIT (also tried with Windows Server 2008 R2 Trial and Win XP)

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  • Windows Explorer Hangs on Right-Click

    - by Bryan
    I am not sure if this is the right site to post this one as I typically post coding questions on stackoverflow. But I'll ask anyways and hopefully someone can move it if it's incorrect. Currently I have a customer built PC, utilizing an Intel i7 chip, 1300WATT PSU, 8Gigs of RAM, and two video cards. Originally I had the one video card (NVIDIA) that used the PSU and had two DVI output. After purchasing a third monitor I installed another ATI) graphics card not needed any PSU connectors. After installing and restarting, I noticed that when I right-click on my desktop, or through Windows Explorer it will hang, freeze then restarted. Sometimes after Windows Explorer restarts the problem dissipates. I checked to make sure everything was connected properly and it was. I repaired the ATI Catalyst Control Center to see if that had an issue, and I checked to see if either video card required updated drivers. Nothing worked. I tried restarting my PC and that didn't work. I tried using ShellXView (I forgot what it's actually called) and tried closed processes but that didn't work. Does anyone have any idea what could have caused this orpossible solutions I should try?< Thanks in advance.

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  • GVIM hangs when saving through GVFS' FTP

    - by Lie Ryan
    I loved Gnome's Nautilus and FTP integration and being able to mount a remote FTP directory as a regular bookmark/directory, and double clicking any remote files to open in any unmodified program. I also loved editing text files with GVim. However, if I double clicked file on Nautilus to open a text file in Gvim, then saving a file will take about 10 seconds and GVim will hang for that amount of time. The major irritant is that I cannot continue editing while the text editor is waiting for the write to finish, this delay interrupted my workflow and thought process and saving becomes a painful process. The other problem is that I don't think simply uploading a file should take that much time. I'm aware of GVim's internal FTP support, but they are not as well integrated with Nautilus's FTP. So a few question: Is there a way to make GVim or GVFS to save in background while I continue editing? Why is GVFS so slow? Is there any way to set GVFS to use a single persistent FTP connection instead of creating a new FTP connection each time? I'm on Gentoo Linux x86-64.

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  • ESXi 5 VM Putty session hangs, vSphere client timing out

    - by user192702
    First of all I believe this is a ESXi issue but let me know if you have seen this. It started about a year ago when I noticed occasionally when I putty via SSH to my VM guests, if I do anything that makes it to display a lot of things at once, the session will hang and I have to start a new one quite often only to find the same behaviour. What I meant by display a lot of things can be any of the following: 1) tail -f filename 2) Paste a long command 3) less filename If I type in one character at a time this won't happen. I tried searching online and it always point me to flow control settings and the various suggestions I've tried have never been able to resolve the issue. Since last week, I've noticed I'm not able to connect to my POP3 server from Outlook (it's timing out from Outlook's perspective). Today I tried to connect to the ESXi via vSphere client and it gives me a time out also. Exact behavior and error I saw is similar to the one posted at the following URL but the suggested technique also failed to resolve the issue. http://davidcocke.blogspot.hk/2012/02/unable-to-login-with-vsphere-client.html Has anyone experienced this before? Any suggestions on how to troubleshoot this?

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  • Using IIS6 to run kill process. Executable hangs

    - by David
    I'm using the following code (any tried many variations) in a web page that is supposed to kill a process on the server: Process scriptProc = new Process(); SecureString password = new SecureString(); password.AppendChar('p'); password.AppendChar('s'); password.AppendChar('s'); password.AppendChar('w'); password.AppendChar('d'); scriptProc.StartInfo.UserName = "mylocaluser"; scriptProc.StartInfo.Password = password; scriptProc.StartInfo.FileName = @"C:\WINDOWS\System32\WScript.exe"; scriptProc.StartInfo.Arguments = @"c:\windows\system32\killMyApp.vbs"; scriptProc.StartInfo.UseShellExecute = false; scriptProc.Start(); scriptProc.WaitForExit(); scriptProc.Close(); The VBS file is supposed to kill a w3wp.exe process, but never works. There are no errors in the application log. It works locally. I noticed WScript.exe is in task manager every time I run the page, and never goes away. The process WScript.exe (and I tried others such a psexec.exe) is being run as a local user with admin rights (and I tried other types of users including domain admins) when run from IIS, but it works when run from the command line on the server.

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  • Windows 7 Home hangs at "Welcome" screen

    - by White Phoenix
    I'm asking on behalf of a friend who's currently having problems with his machine. Windows 7 Home 32-bit. He's too far away for me to help by going over to his house - I'm helping him over the Internet. This is his current machine: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883227134 The only two changes he made to that machine is to swap out the gfx card for a EVGA GTX 460 and the PSU for a Corsair TX650. Here's what happened: He was playing a computer game (fairly CPU/GPU intensive) and had some music going in the background in foobar while playing. Suddenly, he notices the music stopped playing, so he switches to foobar to try to close it, but it freezes up (window won't respond). So he figures it's just foobar having a bad day and force quits that program. Suddenly, his game won't respond, so he force quits that, then the entire computer just went to crap at that point, so he hits the restart button on his machine. Computer POSTS fine, but now he gets stuck at the Windows "welcome" screen (his account is set to auto-login). HD activity light is solid yellow but he doesn't hear HDD activity. He tried booting into Safe Mode - gets stuck at the "welcome screen". Tried a STartup Repair within Windows 7, it found a few problems, but still gets stuck at welcome. I advised him to boot off the DVD - sfc /scannow found nothing (couldn't use the regular /scannow option; says there's a repair pending, had to use use offbootdir/offwindir command switches). Ran startup repair 3 times - found nothing. My friend runs virus/malware scans on a regular basis, so he's fairly sure it's not that either. Right now I'm having my friend run chkdsk /R on the computer while in this Startup Recovery mode - so far it's caught a few bad sectors. However at this point I'm kinda wondering which way to go if chkdsk doesn't fix it. Quick Google search said someone had success by booting Windows with bootlogging on - some others have success with running the aforemented chkdsk, etc. The fact that Windows cannot even boot into Safe Mode concerns me. While we're waiting for chkdsk /R to finish, are there any other options I can give my friend short of reinstalling Windows 7? He has his data on a separate partition so that's not a major problem (though it'll be an annoyance for him). I suspect his hard drive may be having some issues, but my main concern is getting him back up and running before we start diagnosing the hard drive (I may have him run some sort of SMART test utility later).

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  • Firefox hangs waiting for ssl.google-analytics.com

    - by squillman
    It seems that FF has a problem with 403 Access Denied responses from proxies, at least for ssl.google-analytics.com. I've found this post which describes my problem. I'm posting my workaround as an answer, but would also welcome any more information if anyone has it as I can't find anything! EDIT: Note that the current version of Firefox which is experiencing this issue is 3.0.10 EDIT: Still there for FF 3.5...

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  • Firefox, Thunderbird, Safari - hangs up on start

    - by takeshin
    I have a strange problem on Windows Vista (Automatic updates). Long time ago I had installed Firefox, Thunderbird, Safari and Opera and they all worked well. Once upon a time, after Windows restart, Firefox, Thunderbird and Safari won't start. [Opera (USB) works fine]. When I start the browser, program name is listed on the processes list, but it is not activated, doesn't show any window. I tried crating new profiles with -ProfileManager, restarting Windows, reinstalling the browsers. I scanned the system for suspected programs and it looks clean. There is 45GB of free HDD space. WTF?

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  • Firefox hangs on downloads

    - by Shandy
    My firefox has begun to hang when/after downloading files generally, but today I got a specific error: chrome://global/content/bindings/general.xml:0 This error came up in the Page Info windoa, Media tab, trying to download an image from a site and after a pause of a minute or so. Any suggestions?

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  • IIS Hangs on SQL Connections when running ASP.net applications

    - by PaulWaldman
    We have a database server running SQL 2000 and two web servers hosting ASP.net applications. All three servers are running Windows Server 2003 SP2. Our issue is repeatable after about 2 weeks, IIS on one web server is no longer able to establish SQL connections. Static content loads fine. Other non-IIS applications are still able to contact the SQL database server. ODBC functionality also still works. While running SQL profiler a connection is never established from IIS when it is in this state. The only way to fix this situation is to restart the web server. There are no firewalls installed on any machines.

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  • Snow Leopard Hangs at Login Window

    - by jessecurry
    I've had an issue for the past few months, but I rarely restart so it hasn't caused too much trouble. Basically, when I start up my Mac (iMac10,1 - 3.06GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, OS X 10.6.3) everything proceeds as usual until I reach the login window. The login window displays normally, but keyboard and mouse input seem to be ignored. This condition persists for around 5 minutes at which time everything goes back to normal. While the login window is frozen my second monitor appears entirely blue, the second monitor receives a background as soon as the login window becomes responsive. If I startup while holding SHIFT the problem still occurs, but the freeze is much shorter. Looking through my logs I see no activity during the time that the login window is frozen. I've attempted to repair disk permissions, and gone through every possible maintenance option in Cocktail.

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  • proftpd - TLS connection hangs authenticating

    - by greydet
    I setup a proftpd server that uses TLS/SSL certificate for authentication. Everything works well when I connect through lftp or Filezilla (with explicit connection). But once I attempt connecting with simple ftp connection from Filezilla, the USER command ends with the 550 response (SSL/TLS required). After that any further connection through lftp or Filezilla (with explicit connection) will hang authenticating. Anyone knows how to workaround this issue? Is there a way to ask Filezilla to automatically use TLS/SSL if required? I am using Ubuntu server 10.04 with proftpd 1.3.2c. There is no error message in the log files.

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  • Ubuntu hangs on boot when NFS-mounting entries in /etc/fstab, but they mount cleanly otherwise

    - by lorin
    I'm managing several Ubuntu 9.10 servers that NFS mount several folders (including /home). I'd like these folders to be mounted at boot time. I would like to have several entries in my /etc/fstab to accomplish this, e.g. 192.168.1.100:/home /home nfs rw 0 0 192.168.1.100:/usr/ansys_inc /ansys_inc nfs ro 0 0 Unfortunately, with this configuration, the servers usually (although not always) hang during the bootup sequence when trying to do the NFS mount. if I comment out these fstab entries, reboot the machine, uncomment them and mount them manually using the shell, the folders mount cleanly. I'm not sure how to go about debugging this problem. It seems like it has something to do with the boot sequence, that some relevant process hasn't been started by the time the OS tries to mount the folders.

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  • Macros in Excel 2010 hangs

    - by Ahmad
    I have a spreadsheet with several macros. Generally, when previously using Excel 2007, a user clicks a button and everything works as expected (calculations, some email sending & file I/O). Typically, the expected run-time is about 90 seconds. The spreadsheet is a xlsm file created with Excel 2007. With Excel 2010 however, the same user process results in a non-responsive excel and forces us to kill excel from the task manager. Some note that I have gathered so far in trying to debug this issue: When monitoring CPU usage, it seems that Excel does start the macro. CPU usage increases as expected to about 47% for a few seconds. Excel.exe than drops to 0% usage and I now have a non-responsive Excel (even after 1 hour). If I set debug break points across modules and different functions and step through the code (after clicking the button) , the process works as expected albeit much slower. To add, there were no exceptions. I am at a complete loss as to what the issue may be. I initially thought it may be the add in that is being used but that was debunked by point 2. This seems to be a very odd situation. I can provide more information if required, but I'm at wits end about the root cause could be. I need help in diagnosing and resolving this issue.

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  • Installer hangs on "waiting for other installations to finish" despite no other installations in progress

    - by clozach
    I started an installation of the Xcode 4 developer's preview last night before going to bed. When I woke up, the installation had popped up a message saying to close Xcode first (doh!). I did so, but whatever script had displayed the message seemed to have hung because the (uncancellable) message wouldn't disappear, and the installer wouldn't progress. After force quitting the Installer app, the message above was still showing, so I restarted my MacBook Pro and then tried the installation again. This time it wouldn't even start, instead showing one of those candy-stripe activity bars and the message: Waiting for other installations to finish At this point, I'm stumped. There are no other installations in progress, so there must be some artifact left over from the interrupted install that's gumming up the works. But what?

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  • Windows 7 hangs with 100% disk activity but only when online

    - by jeremy
    I have the same problem as seemingly many other people here, and I think we might all be experiencing the same issue: a compatibility issue in Windows 7 between hard drive and network controller or drivers. I've tried firmware updates of my entire board, wiping my drive and reinstalling from scratch. And yet the problem persists, which suggests it is an operating system error, as the hard drive checks out 100% physically. Additionally, the only time it does not occur is when in safe mode WITHOUT networking. With networking, there are spikes in disc access every so often and a huge flow of processes accessing the disc simultaneously that literally "stick" the disc, and physically jolting my computer unsticks it. Again, this has been tested for hours in a professional service environment, and without network access on, things are fine. As soon as there's network access available, the disc access occasionally cranks up to 100% and sticks everything. I'm using Microsoft Security Essentials, but this also happened under Norton, then McAfee. Again, this happened again after a complete wipe, so the likelihood of malware causing it seems low. I don't visit unsecure sites anyway, as far as I know. This, to me, narrows it down to a Windows 7 process that is somehow repeatedly corrupted, perhaps a corrupt .dll or driver, causing a conflict at the operating system level and temporary hard drive failure. I would encourage anyone who knows more about this stuff (which is probably most people!) to take a shot at this one, and I would encourage anyone else with a sticking hard drive in windows 7 64-bit to check on whether it occurs during safe mode without networking.

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  • Computer hangs at BIOS screen. Cannot enter setup

    - by d2jxp
    I have an HP Pavilion a6500f (it's a year out of warranty) and it's hanging on the blue HP BIOS screen. If I mash F10 while it's starting up, it will say "Entering Setup..." but I will see no results. It will hang there and not do anything. If I actually wait until I can see the screen and then hit F10, there's no response at all and the computer will sit at the BIOS menu. I've dusted and cleaned it out, reseated the memory, switched the RAM slots, and reset the CMOS battery using the reset jumper. I'm out of ideas. I'm pretty sure it's not a hard drive issue, since my problem is at the BIOS. After this post, I'll disconnect the hard drive and try to just boot without it. Anyone have any other ideas? Edit: Okay, so I tried disconnecting the hard drive and now I can get back into the BIOS. I reconnected it and I'm locked out again. So the problem is my hard drive.. I guess I should delete this post unless someone has any ideas as to what's wrong with the drive?

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  • Outlook Express hangs when selecting multiple emails

    - by Javier Badia
    I'm using Outlook Express (6, I think) on Windows XP. Lately, it has been hanging. Sometimes this happens at startup (right after the main window with all the panes loads) and sometimes when selecting many emails (sometimes as low as three emails at once, sometimes at ten, it's not a fixed number). When this happens, msimn.exe starts to use 98-100% CPU and RAM usage shoots up very quickly, reaching hundreds of megabytes in half a minute. The message pane goes gray instead of showing the message contents. As I said, this sometimes happens right after the main window loads, sometimes when selecting many emails at once. I tried backing up everything, deleting the identities, creating a new one and restoring, but this still happens.

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