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  • What is the difference between running a Windows service vs. running through shell?

    - by Zack
    I am trying to troubleshoot an issue on a Windows 2008 server where running attempting to connect to a "Timberline Data Source" ODBC driver crashes if the call is in a "service" context, but succeeds if the call is initiated manually in a Remote Desktop session. I have set the service to run as my user. I'm wondering if, all else being equal (user, machine, etc), are there any fundamental security/environment differences between running a process as a service vs manually? --- Implementation Details --- In case it is helpful for anyone, I had a system that started as an attempt to connect to a Timberline Database using ODBC and a Python CGI script called via IIS 7. The script itself works fine, however, as soon as I attempt to perform the ODBC connect function, the script crashes without throwing an exception. The script was able to connect fine when executed via command line. The same thing happened when using a C#/.net service, attempting to run via Apache, Windows Scheduler or even a 3rd party scheduling tool. With the last option (the 3rd party scheduling tool, pycron) I set the service up log in as my user and had the same issue (I confirmed via Task Manager that the process running user was, in fact, me). It just doesn't make sense to me why a service, which should be running as my user, appears to still be operating in a different security context or environment. Also, if it's important, the Timberline database is referenced by computer name on the network ("\\timberline-server\Timberline Office\Accounts\AT" or something to that effect) I also realized that, as Joel pointed out, the server DOES have a mapped drive ("Y:" which is mapped to "\\timberline-server\Timberline Office") The DSN is set up at the "System DSN" level which, according to the ODBC Administration Tool, means that the DSN is available to users and services Since I'm not allowed to answer this question yet, I'll post the solution that I arrived on: As Joel Coel mentioned, there actually was a mapped drive scenario. I didn't realize this because the DSN specified a path using UNC. However, it seems as though the actual Timberline Driver referred to a mapped drive. Since services don't start with the mapped drive, I was forced to add the drive mapping code into my service. Since it was written in python, I used code from a Stackoverflow answer that was able to map the drive on the fly.

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  • Creating a Linux cluster/cloud to act as a server.

    - by Kavon Farvardin
    I have about four or five machines in the Pentium 3-4 era and I'm interested in creating a Linux server comprised of these machines. The server's main purposes would be to host several low-medium traffic websites/services (voice and game), and share terabytes of data on a local network. I could probably throw together one modern computer as a server and call it a day, but I'm interested in using these machines to do it instead. Where would I get started in this cluster/cloud setup?

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  • How to run your own cloud network at home?

    - by Xeoncross
    I have 7 PC's around the house that total more than 10Ghz in CPU power. I was wondering if I could put them to use building my own "cloud computing" network to help with rendering videos, blender animations, Photoshop effects, or anything else. Does something like this exists - and if so what is it called and where do I find it?

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  • Message pump in C# Windows service

    - by Pickles
    Hello, I have a Windows Service written in C# that handles all of our external hardware I/O for a kiosk application. One of our new devices is a USB device that comes with an API in a native DLL. I have a proper P/Invoke wrapper class created. However, this API must be initialized with an HWnd to a windows application because it uses the message pump to raise asynchronous events. Besides putting in a request to the hardware manufacturer to provide us with an API that does not depend on a Windows message pump, is there any way to manually instantiate a message pump in a new thread in my Windows Service that I can pass into this API? Do I actually have to create a full Application class, or is there a lower level .NET class that encapsulates a message pump? Thanks

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  • WCF Windows Service Monitor and process emails

    - by acadia
    Hello, I need your suggestions in solving this issue. Here is the requirement. We have a Microsoft Exchange server and we have a service email account [email protected]. We have scanners all owner the company when a user scans a document and email is sent to [email protected] as attachment. Now I need to write a Windows service which needs to monitor that email account and whenever an email is received, read the attachement and store it in the database. My question is, is it possible to do something of this sort? Any suggestions greatly appreciated. Thanks

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  • Oracle’s New Approach to Cloud-based Applications User Experiences

    - by Oracle OpenWorld Blog Team
    By Misha Vaughan It was an exciting Oracle OpenWorld this year for customers and partners, as they got to see what their input into the Oracle user experience research and development process has produced for cloud-delivered applications. The result of all this engagement and listening is a focus on simplicity, mobility, and extensibility. These were the core themes across Oracle OpenWorld sessions, executive roundtables, and analyst briefings given by Jeremy Ashley, Oracle's vice president of user experience. The highlight of every meeting with a customer featured the new simplified UI for Oracle’s cloud applications.    Attendees at some sessions and events also saw a vision of what is coming next in the Oracle user experience, and they gave direct feedback on whether this would help solve their business problems.  What did attendees think of what they saw this year? Rebecca Wettemann of Nucleus Research was part of  an analyst briefing on next-generation user experiences from Oracle. Here’s what she told CRM Buyer in an interview just after the event:  “Many of the improvements are incremental, which is not surprising, as Oracle regularly updates its application,” Rebecca Wettemann, vice president of Nucleus Research, told CRM Buyer. "Still, there are distinct themes to this latest set of changes. One is usability. Oracle Sales Cloud, for example, is designed to have zero training for onboarding sales reps, which it does," she explained. "It is quite impressive, actually—the intuitive nature of the application and the design work they have done with this goal in mind. The software uses as few buttons and fields as possible," she pointed out. "The sales rep doesn't have to ask, 'what is the next step?' because she can see what it is."  What else did we hear? Oracle OpenWorld is a time when we can take a broader pulse of our customers’ and partners’ concerns. This year we heard some common user experience themes on the following: · A desire to continue to simplify widely used self-service tasks · A need to understand how customers or partners could take some of the UX lessons learned on simplicity and mobility into their own custom areas and projects  · The continuing challenge of needing to support bring-your-own-device and corporate-provided mobile devices to end users · A desire to harmonize user experiences across platforms for specific business-use cases  What does this mean for next year? Well, there were a lot of things we could only show to smaller groups of customers in our Oracle OpenWorld usability labs and HQ lab tours, to partners at our Expo, and to analysts under non-disclosure agreements. But we used these events as a way to get some early feedback about where we are focusing for the year ahead. Attendees gave us a positive response: @bkhan Saw some excellent UX innovations at the expo “@usableapps: Great job @mishavaughan and @vinoskey on #oow13 UX partner expo!” @WarnerTim @usableapps @mishavaughan @vinoskey @ultan Thanks for an interesting afternoon definitely liked the UX tool kits for partners. You can expect Oracle to continue pushing themes of simplicity, mobility, and extensibility even more aggressively in the next year.  If you are interested to find out what really goes on in the UX labs, such as what we are doing with smartphones, tablets, heads-up displays, and the AppsLab robots, feel free to reach out to me for more information: Misha Vaughan or on Twitter: @mishavaughan.

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  • Sql Server Service Broker Conversation Groups

    - by Brian Hasden
    Can someone explain conversation groups in service broker? Currently, I'm using service broker to send messages from one SQL server to another. On the sending server, I'm trying to correlate the messages so they are processed in serial on the receiving side. Based on the documentation, conversation groups seem to be a perfect fit for this, but on the receiving server, the messages get assigned to a different conversation group from the one I specified when sending the message. I've search around the web and saw that this behavior seems to be intended (http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/forums/en-US/sqlservicebroker/thread/baf48074-6804-43ab-844a-cb28a6dce02b/), but then I'm confused about the usefulness of the syntax from (http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms178624.aspx) WAITFOR( GET CONVERSATION GROUP @conversation_group_id FROM [dbo].[ReceiveQueue] ) If the conversation group doesn't come across with the message from the sender and messages sent with the same conversation group id don't have the same conversation group id on the receive side, what's the point of the code above?

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  • Windows Service HTTPListener Memory Issue

    - by crawshaws
    Hi all, Im a complete novice to the "best practices" etc of writing in any code. I tend to just write it an if it works, why fix it. Well, this way of working is landing me in some hot water. I am writing a simple windows service to server a single webpage. (This service will be incorperated in to another project which monitors the services and some folders on a group of servers.) My problem is that whenever a request is recieved, the memory usage jumps up by a few K per request and keeps qoing up on every request. Now ive found that by putting GC.Collect in the mix it stops at a certain number but im sure its not meant to be used this way. I was wondering if i am missing something or not doing something i should to free up memory. Here is the code: Public Class SimpleWebService : Inherits ServiceBase 'Set the values for the different event log types. Public Const EVENT_ERROR As Integer = 1 Public Const EVENT_WARNING As Integer = 2 Public Const EVENT_INFORMATION As Integer = 4 Public listenerThread As Thread Dim HTTPListner As HttpListener Dim blnKeepAlive As Boolean = True Shared Sub Main() Dim ServicesToRun As ServiceBase() ServicesToRun = New ServiceBase() {New SimpleWebService()} ServiceBase.Run(ServicesToRun) End Sub Protected Overrides Sub OnStart(ByVal args As String()) If Not HttpListener.IsSupported Then CreateEventLogEntry("Windows XP SP2, Server 2003, or higher is required to " & "use the HttpListener class.") Me.Stop() End If Try listenerThread = New Thread(AddressOf ListenForConnections) listenerThread.Start() Catch ex As Exception CreateEventLogEntry(ex.Message) End Try End Sub Protected Overrides Sub OnStop() blnKeepAlive = False End Sub Private Sub CreateEventLogEntry(ByRef strEventContent As String) Dim sSource As String Dim sLog As String sSource = "Service1" sLog = "Application" If Not EventLog.SourceExists(sSource) Then EventLog.CreateEventSource(sSource, sLog) End If Dim ELog As New EventLog(sLog, ".", sSource) ELog.WriteEntry(strEventContent) End Sub Public Sub ListenForConnections() HTTPListner = New HttpListener HTTPListner.Prefixes.Add("http://*:1986/") HTTPListner.Start() Do While blnKeepAlive Dim ctx As HttpListenerContext = HTTPListner.GetContext() Dim HandlerThread As Thread = New Thread(AddressOf ProcessRequest) HandlerThread.Start(ctx) HandlerThread = Nothing Loop HTTPListner.Stop() End Sub Private Sub ProcessRequest(ByVal ctx As HttpListenerContext) Dim sb As StringBuilder = New StringBuilder sb.Append("<html><body><h1>Test My Service</h1>") sb.Append("</body></html>") Dim buffer() As Byte = Encoding.UTF8.GetBytes(sb.ToString) ctx.Response.ContentLength64 = buffer.Length ctx.Response.OutputStream.Write(buffer, 0, buffer.Length) ctx.Response.OutputStream.Close() ctx.Response.Close() sb = Nothing buffer = Nothing ctx = Nothing 'This line seems to keep the mem leak down 'System.GC.Collect() End Sub End Class Please feel free to critisise and tear the code apart but please BE KIND. I have admitted I dont tend to follow the best practice when it comes to coding.

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  • Message pump in .NET Windows service

    - by Pickles
    I have a Windows Service written in C# that handles all of our external hardware I/O for a kiosk application. One of our new devices is a USB device that comes with an API in a native DLL. I have a proper P/Invoke wrapper class created. However, this API must be initialized with an HWnd to a windows application because it uses the message pump to raise asynchronous events. Besides putting in a request to the hardware manufacturer to provide us with an API that does not depend on a Windows message pump, is there any way to manually instantiate a message pump in a new thread in my Windows Service that I can pass into this API? Do I actually have to create a full Application class, or is there a lower level .NET class that encapsulates a message pump?

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  • Force CloudFront distribution/file update

    - by Martin
    I'm using Amazon's CloudFront to serve static files of my web apps. Is there no way to tell a cloudfront distribution that it needs to refresh it's file or point out a single file that should be refreshed? Amazon recommend that you version your files like logo_1.gif, logo_2.gif and so on as a workaround for this problem but that seems like a pretty stupid solution. Is there absolutely no other way?

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  • Just Another Web Service (JAWS) vs SOA

    Over the last few years SOA has been a hot topic lending it to be abused by many that have no understanding of the concept. In my opinion, one of the largest issues facing SOA is the lack of understanding and experience implementing SOA by business and IT alike. I just recently deployed a new web services that is called by multiple service clients. Would you call this SOA because it is a web service that can be called by any requesting client? In my opinion, this is not SOA; instead it is Just Another Web Service (JAWS).  Just because a company creates a web service does not mean that they are using SOA, in fact it only means that they are using a web service. SOA is an architectural style that focuses on the design of systems based on the consumer and providers thorough the use of contracts.  With this approach SOA needs to be applied for the top down in order for it to reach its full potential. In the case of the web service, the service is just a small part of the entire system that is reusable and has the flexibility to change. In order for a company in this case to move towards SOA then they need to define business processes that can be shared through the use of reusable software and loose coupling. Once the company’s thought and development process change to address changes in this manner they can start to become more SOA.

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  • Creating Service with Bluetooth activation in Android

    - by Mr. Kakakuwa Bird
    Hi I want to create a service in Android which will initially ask user if they want to start Bluetooth and set the Bluetooth discovery. My question is 1) Can I launch in the service following activities? if (!mBluetoothAdapter.isEnabled()) { Intent enableBtIntent = new Intent(BluetoothAdapter.ACTION_REQUEST_ENABLE); startActivityForResult(enableBtIntent, 0); } // Set Phone Discoverable for 300 seconds. Intent discoverableIntent = new Intent(BluetoothAdapter.ACTION_REQUEST_DISCOVERABLE); discoverableIntent.putExtra(BluetoothAdapter.EXTRA_DISCOVERABLE_DURATION, 600); startActivity(discoverableIntent); 2) I want to set discoverabilty of the phone on for lifetime of application. Is it possible? 3) I want to access empty space available on SD card. How should i do it? Thanks in advance.

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  • SSIS web service task parsing result.

    - by dbengals
    I have an ssis (2005) package that uses the web service task to download to a file destination. The file contains a string of xml data. After downloaded the file looks like this. <?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-16"?> <string>--here is XML data with escaped characters--</string> My thought was I could then use the XML source data flow source to pull the <string> data, but when I set this up the XML source will not read the <string> as a column. It will generate an xsd and it seems normal, but no luck seeing the column. Any ideas on getting this to work? Or would there be a better way to pull the data within the file generated from the web service? Thanks.

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  • FACING ERROR WHILE CALLING AXIS2 WEB SERVICE ...

    - by darshanv
    Hello , I am new to axis ,I have created a web servcie with couple of methods using axis2 and deployed it on tomcat.And am calling that web service from my android program with the help of ksoap.But wen i call a method which doesn't take any parameter am gettin fine reply from web service which i can able to see on my screen,But wen i call anothr method which takes a string argument am getting namespace exception on server WEB SERVICE CODE IS ..... package Guru; public class DarshanSays { public String getMsg(String h) { return h+" ..the power of change is eVolution..."; } public String getEmpty(String d)throws Exception { return "empty string from tomcattttttttttt"; } } //AND program is String soap_action="http://Guru/getEmpty"; String method_nm="getEmpty"; String nmspc="http://Guru/"; String url7="//192.168.10.182:8080/axis2/services/Friday";//http: SoapObject request = new SoapObject(url7,method_nm); /*sending method parameters with SoapObject */ request.newInstance(); request.addProperty("h","darshan.....");//sending a parameter to a method SoapSerializationEnvelope envelope = new SoapSerializationEnvelope(SoapEnvelope.VER11); envelope.bodyOut=request; envelope.dotNet = true; envelope.encodingStyle = SoapSerializationEnvelope.XSD; Log.d("Step","3"); envelope.dotNet=true; /*setting outputsoap object sending request */ envelope.setOutputSoapObject(request); /*HttpTransportSE object creating sending it url */ androidHttpTransport = new HttpTransportSE(url7); //androidHttpTransport.setXmlVersionTag(""); Log.d("Step","4"); try{ androidHttpTransport.debug=true; androidHttpTransport.call(nmspc,envelope); } catch(Exception e) { Log.d("Transportcall",""+e); alert=new AlertDialog.Builder(this); alert.setMessage(""+e); alert.show(); } //exception is throw. Log.d("Step","5"); try { Log.d("giving...","resp"); SoapPrimitive sp=(SoapPrimitive)envelope.getResponse(); String hh=sp.toString(); Log.d("reply from web ser",".."+hh.toString()); //and erorr msg is SoapFault - faultcode:'soapenv:Server' faultstring: 'namespace mismatch require http://Guru found 192.168.10.182:8080/axis2/services/Friday' faultactor: 'null' detail: org.kxml2.kdom.Node@43d31390 ERROR IS coming only when am calling parameterized method. I am facing this issue only when am giving a call to parameterized method. Please Help.. thanks Darshan V

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  • Adding IoC Support to my WCF service hosted in a windows service (Autofac)

    - by user137348
    I'd like to setup my WCF services to use an IoC Container. There's an article in the Autofac wiki about WCF integration, but it's showing just an integration with a service hosted in IIS. But my services are hosted in a windows service. Here I got an advice to hook up the opening event http://groups.google.com/group/autofac/browse_thread/thread/23eb7ff07d8bfa03 I've followed the advice and this is what I got so far: private void RunService<T>() { var builder = new ContainerBuilder(); builder.Register(c => new DataAccessAdapter("1")).As<IDataAccessAdapter>(); ServiceHost serviceHost = new ServiceHost(typeof(T)); serviceHost.Opening += (sender, args) => serviceHost.Description.Behaviors.Add( new AutofacDependencyInjectionServiceBehavior(builder.Build(), typeof(T), ??? )); serviceHost.Open(); } The AutofacDependencyInjectionServiceBehavior has a ctor which takes 3 parameters. The third one is of type IComponentRegistration and I have no idea where can I get it from. Any ideas ? Thanks in advance.

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  • unit/integration testing web service proxy client

    - by cori
    I'm rewriting a PHP client/proxy library that provides an interface to a SOAP-based .Net webservice, and in the process I want to add some unit and integration tests so future modifications are less risky. The work the library I'm working on performs is to marshall the calls to the web service and do a little reorganizing of the responses to present a slightly more -object-oriented interface to the underlying service. Since this library is little else than a thin layer on top of web service calls, my basic assumption is that I'll really be writing integration tests more than unit tests - for example, I don't see any reason to mock away the web service - the work that's performed by the code I'm working on is very light; it's almost passing the response from the service right back to its consumer. Most of the calls are basic CRUD operations: CreateRole(), CreateUser(), DeleteUser(), FindUser(), &ct. I'll be starting from a known database state - the system I'm using for these tests is isolated for testing purposes, so the results will be more or less predictable. My question is this: is it natural to use web service calls to confirm the results of operations within the tests and to reset the state of the application within the scope of each test? Here's an example: One test might be createUserReturnsValidUserId() and might go like this: public function createUserReturnsValidUserId() { // we're assuming a global connection to the service $newUserId = $client->CreateUser("user1"); assertNotNull($newUserId); assertNotNull($client->FindUser($newUserId); $client->deleteUser($newUserId); } So I'm creating a user, making sure I get an ID back and that it represents a user in the system, and then cleaning up after myself (so that later tests don't rely on the success or failure of this test w/r/t the number of users in the system, for example). However this still seems pretty fragile - lots of dependencies and opportunities for tests to fail and effect the results of later tests, which I definitely want to avoid. Am I missing some options of ways to decouple these tests from the system under test, or is this really the best I can do? I think this is a fairly general unit/integration testing question, but if it matters I'm using PHPUnit for the testing framework.

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  • Presenting the Cloud in a Different Way

    - by BuckWoody
    I had the honor of presenting the Developers at the Portland PASS chapter, and decided to go a different way than just using PowerPoint Slides…. (click on any picture to enlarge) The point is that when you need to get a point across, it’s OK to change tactics to make sure the information sticks. In this case, I decided to make the audience the PowerPoint. I used a few props to show the various paradigms we use to describe what the industry uses for the word “cloud” First, we talked about Infrastructure as a Service. I picked a gentleman who didn’t quite fit the hard hat and safety vest I picked out for him. Notice our “user” as she accesses our “Server” (complete with tray and glass) which has been virtualized.    Software as a service comes next. In this case, the user and potentially even customers just access software (represented here as a Windows ME box…) remotely – everything is virtualized. Finally, Platform as a Service – Yup, Platform shoes as a necklace, and a tie-dye shirt to represent the 70’s – a decade when mainframes used stateless programming as well. Notice also the components of Windows Azure – Compute (Keyboard) Application Fabric (Toy Bus) and Storage (Bucket).   And at the end of the day, it’s all about serving those customers…

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  • Android - Having a service run every day at 4AM

    - by Bara
    Hello everyone, I would like to know the best practices for running a Service every day at 4AM. The way I think I should be doing it is to create a new repeating alarm using AlarmManager and having it run the service at 4AM. Problem is, I'm not sure where to put the code to set the alarm. Do I do it in my main activity as one of the first tasks in the OnCreate method? Do I do some funky stuff with BroadcastReceivers and intents? What happens when a user updates my app? What happens when a user restarts? Any help with these questions would be much appreciated :) Sample code would be helpful as well! Bara

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  • Cloud hosted CI for .NET projects

    - by Scott Dorman
    Originally posted on: http://geekswithblogs.net/sdorman/archive/2014/06/02/cloud-hosted-ci-for-.net-projects.aspxContinuous integration (CI) is important. If you don’t have it set up…you should. There are a lot of different options available for hosting your own CI server, but they all require you to maintain your own infrastructure. If you’re a business, that generally isn’t a problem. However, if you have some open source projects hosted, for example on GitHub, there haven’t really been any options. That has changed with the latest release of AppVeyor, which bills itself as “Continuous integration for busy developers.” What’s different about AppVeyor is that it’s a hosted solution. Why is that important? By being a hosted solution, it means that I don’t have to maintain my own infrastructure for a build server. How does that help if you’re hosting an open source project? AppVeyor has a really competitive pricing plan. For an unlimited amount of public repositories, it’s free. That gives you a cloud hosted CI system for all of your GitHub projects for the cost of some time to set them up, which actually isn’t hard to do at all. I have several open source projects (hosted at https://github.com/scottdorman), so I signed up using my GitHub credentials. AppVeyor fully supported my two-factor authentication with GitHub, so I never once had to enter my password for GitHub into AppVeyor. Once it was done, I authorized GitHub and it instantly found all of the repositories I have (both the ones I created and the ones I cloned from elsewhere). You can even add “build badges” to your markdown files in GitHub, so anyone who visits your project can see the status of the lasted build. Out of the box, you can simply select a repository, add the build project, click New Build and wait for the build to complete. You now have a complete CI server running for your project. The best part of this, besides the fact that it “just worked” with almost zero configuration is that you can configure it through a web-based interface which is very streamlined, clean and easy to use or you can use a appveyor.yml file. This means that you can define your CI build process (including any scripts that might need to be run, etc.) in a standard file format (the YAML format) and store it in your repository. The benefits to that are huge. The file becomes a versioned artifact in your source control system, so it can be branched, merged, and is completely transparent to anyone working on the project. By the way, AppVeyor isn’t limited to just GitHub. It currently supports GitHub, BitBucket, Visual Studio Online, and Kiln. I did have a few issues getting one of my projects to build, but the same day I posted the problem to the support forum a fix was deployed, and I had a functioning CI build about 5 minutes after that. Since then, I’ve provided some additional feature requests and had a few other questions, all of which have seen responses within a 24-hour period. I have to say that it’s easily been one of the best customer support experiences I’ve seen in a long time. AppVeyor is still young, so it doesn’t yet have full feature parity with some of the older (more established) CI systems available,  but it’s getting better all the time and I have no doubt that it will quickly catch up to those other CI systems and then pass them. The bottom line, if you’re looking for a good cloud-hosted CI system for your .NET-based projects, look at AppVeyor.

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  • Constructor Injection and when to use a Service Locator

    - by Simon
    I'm struggling to understand parts of StructureMap's usage. In particular, in the documentation a statement is made regarding a common anti-pattern, the use of StructureMap as a Service Locator only instead of constructor injection (code samples straight from Structuremap documentation): public ShippingScreenPresenter() { _service = ObjectFactory.GetInstance<IShippingService>(); _repository = ObjectFactory.GetInstance<IRepository>(); } instead of: public ShippingScreenPresenter(IShippingService service, IRepository repository) { _service = service; _repository = repository; } This is fine for a very short object graph, but when dealing with objects many levels deep, does this imply that you should pass down all the dependencies required by the deeper objects right from the top? Surely this breaks encapsulation and exposes too much information about the implementation of deeper objects. Let's say I'm using the Active Record pattern, so my record needs access to a data repository to be able to save and load itself. If this record is loaded inside an object, does that object call ObjectFactory.CreateInstance() and pass it into the active record's constructor? What if that object is inside another object. Does it take the IRepository in as its own parameter from further up? That would expose to the parent object the fact that we're access the data repository at this point, something the outer object probably shouldn't know. public class OuterClass { public OuterClass(IRepository repository) { // Why should I know that ThingThatNeedsRecord needs a repository? // that smells like exposed implementation to me, especially since // ThingThatNeedsRecord doesn't use the repo itself, but passes it // to the record. // Also where do I create repository? Have to instantiate it somewhere // up the chain of objects ThingThatNeedsRecord thing = new ThingThatNeedsRecord(repository); thing.GetAnswer("question"); } } public class ThingThatNeedsRecord { public ThingThatNeedsRecord(IRepository repository) { this.repository = repository; } public string GetAnswer(string someParam) { // create activeRecord(s) and process, returning some result // part of which contains: ActiveRecord record = new ActiveRecord(repository, key); } private IRepository repository; } public class ActiveRecord { public ActiveRecord(IRepository repository) { this.repository = repository; } public ActiveRecord(IRepository repository, int primaryKey); { this.repositry = repository; Load(primaryKey); } public void Save(); private void Load(int primaryKey) { this.primaryKey = primaryKey; // access the database via the repository and set someData } private IRepository repository; private int primaryKey; private string someData; } Any thoughts would be appreciated. Simon

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